WEBVTT 00:00.910 --> 00:01.950 - Good afternoon, everyone. 00:01.950 --> 00:05.103 Thank you so much for coming, especially on a Friday. 00:05.600 --> 00:07.330 Today, the State Department released 00:07.330 --> 00:11.483 the 2017 Country Reports on Human Rights Practices. 00:13.279 --> 00:15.120 Promoting and defending human rights 00:15.120 --> 00:16.820 and fundamental freedoms are central 00:16.820 --> 00:19.540 to who we are as a country, and the United States will 00:19.540 --> 00:21.340 continue to support those around the world 00:21.340 --> 00:24.223 struggling for human dignity and liberty. 00:24.710 --> 00:27.100 This is the 42nd annual Human Rights Report 00:27.100 --> 00:28.950 that the department has now released. 00:29.100 --> 00:31.560 We're delighted to have our Acting Secretary of State, 00:31.560 --> 00:33.120 John Sullivan, with us here today 00:33.120 --> 00:35.923 to say a few words about this report. 00:36.260 --> 00:38.360 After Acting Secretary Sullivan's remarks, 00:38.360 --> 00:41.160 we will invite Ambassador Michael Kozak to the podium 00:41.160 --> 00:42.810 to answer some of your questions. 00:42.870 --> 00:44.560 I will help facilitate, as we all know 00:44.560 --> 00:47.073 one another, and assist with that. 00:47.230 --> 00:50.460 Ambassador Kozak is a senior bureau official 00:50.560 --> 00:54.010 with the Bureau of Democracy, Human Rights, and Labor, 00:54.010 --> 00:56.110 and he's looking forward to speaking with you shortly. 00:56.110 --> 00:58.300 He has served this department 00:58.490 --> 01:01.420 under Republican and Democrat administrations 01:01.770 --> 01:04.290 for 46 years, which is incredible. 01:04.290 --> 01:06.800 Sir, thank you for your service to the State Department. 01:06.800 --> 01:08.610 And with that, I will hand over the podium 01:08.610 --> 01:11.013 to our Acting Secretary John Sullivan, sir. 01:16.880 --> 01:17.970 - Thank you, Heather. 01:17.970 --> 01:19.130 Good afternoon, everyone. 01:19.130 --> 01:21.860 It's an honor to be here to formally release 01:21.860 --> 01:25.513 the 2017 Country Reports on Human Rights Practices. 01:26.300 --> 01:28.980 Now in their 42nd year, these reports are 01:28.980 --> 01:32.513 a natural outgrowth of our values as Americans. 01:33.110 --> 01:34.990 The founding documents of our country 01:34.990 --> 01:38.507 speak to unalienable rights, fundamental freedoms, 01:38.507 --> 01:42.030 and the rule of law, revolutionary concepts 01:42.030 --> 01:43.780 at the time of our founding that are now 01:43.780 --> 01:45.660 woven into the fabric of America 01:45.660 --> 01:48.313 and its interests both at home and abroad. 01:48.980 --> 01:51.750 Promoting human rights and the idea that every person 01:51.750 --> 01:55.340 has inherent dignity is a core element 01:55.340 --> 01:57.463 of this administration's foreign policy. 01:58.020 --> 02:01.800 It also strengthens U.S. national security by fostering 02:01.800 --> 02:05.623 greater peace, stability, and prosperity around the world. 02:06.390 --> 02:09.130 The Human Rights Reports are the most comprehensive 02:09.130 --> 02:13.853 and factual accounting of the global state of human rights. 02:14.420 --> 02:17.690 They help our government and others formulate policies 02:17.970 --> 02:21.060 and encourage both friends and foes to respect 02:21.060 --> 02:24.283 the dignity of all individuals without discrimination. 02:25.410 --> 02:28.380 This year, we have sharpened the focus of the report 02:28.810 --> 02:32.180 to be more responsive to statutory reporting requirements 02:32.700 --> 02:36.170 and more focused on government action or inaction 02:36.500 --> 02:39.500 with regard to the promotion and protection of human rights. 02:39.990 --> 02:44.080 For example, each executive summary includes a paragraph 02:44.270 --> 02:46.660 to note the most egregious abuses 02:46.660 --> 02:48.713 that occurred in a particular country, 02:49.110 --> 02:53.343 including those against women, LGBTI persons, 02:53.670 --> 02:57.023 persons with disabilities, indigenous persons, 02:57.260 --> 02:59.583 and members of religious minorities. 03:00.800 --> 03:02.610 Before I turn the podium over to Mike, 03:02.610 --> 03:05.223 I'd like to discuss a few countries in particular, 03:05.430 --> 03:08.430 including some with the most egregious human rights records. 03:09.450 --> 03:11.400 The entire world is aware of the horrendous 03:11.400 --> 03:14.730 human rights abuses in Syria, including barrel bombing 03:14.730 --> 03:17.633 of civilians, attacks on hospitals, 03:17.820 --> 03:19.840 widespread reports of rape and abuse 03:19.840 --> 03:21.663 by Syrian Government personnel. 03:22.468 --> 03:25.223 A week ago, the President took action, 03:25.480 --> 03:27.853 together with our French and British allies, 03:28.140 --> 03:30.200 to deter the use of chemical weapons 03:30.390 --> 03:33.083 and protect the human rights of Syrian civilians. 03:34.160 --> 03:36.880 We condemn the ethnic cleansing of Rohingya in Burma 03:37.290 --> 03:39.390 and the atrocities committed against them, 03:39.540 --> 03:42.563 and we are working with partners to address that crisis. 03:43.050 --> 03:46.260 More than 670,000 Rohingya have fled 03:46.260 --> 03:48.513 to Bangladesh in recent months. 03:48.920 --> 03:50.660 Hundreds of thousands of civilians 03:50.660 --> 03:52.313 have been internally displaced. 03:52.920 --> 03:55.860 Those responsible for the violations, abuses, 03:55.860 --> 03:58.543 and attacks must be held accountable. 03:59.700 --> 04:02.460 The DPRK is one of the most repressive 04:02.480 --> 04:05.313 and abusive regimes in the world. 04:05.920 --> 04:08.700 As the report makes clear, the Kim regime 04:08.700 --> 04:11.500 systematically neglects the well-being of its people 04:11.940 --> 04:15.830 to underwrite and fund its illicit weapons programs 04:16.070 --> 04:18.373 via forced labor, child labor, 04:18.480 --> 04:20.823 and the export of North Korean workers. 04:21.670 --> 04:24.250 China continues to spread the worst features 04:24.250 --> 04:27.300 of its authoritarian system, including restrictions 04:27.300 --> 04:31.223 on activists, civil society, freedom of expression, 04:31.380 --> 04:33.373 and the use of arbitrary surveillance. 04:34.160 --> 04:36.343 The absence of an independent judiciary, 04:36.460 --> 04:38.960 the government's crackdown in independent lawyers, 04:39.080 --> 04:42.673 and tight controls on information undermine the rule of law. 04:43.260 --> 04:45.190 We're particularly concerned about the efforts 04:45.190 --> 04:47.360 of Chinese authorities to eliminate 04:47.360 --> 04:50.690 the religious, linguistic, and cultural identities 04:50.790 --> 04:53.853 of Uighur Muslims and Tibetan Buddhists, 04:54.070 --> 04:56.720 as well as restrictions on the worship of Christians. 04:57.480 --> 04:59.670 The Iranian people continue to suffer 04:59.670 --> 05:01.203 at the hands of their leaders. 05:01.670 --> 05:03.480 The right of peaceful assembly 05:03.490 --> 05:06.700 and freedoms of association and expression are 05:06.700 --> 05:10.563 the legitimate expectation of all individuals worldwide. 05:11.210 --> 05:13.513 Unfortunately for the Iranian people, 05:13.780 --> 05:16.973 these human rights are under attack almost daily. 05:17.820 --> 05:20.680 In Turkey, the detention of tens of thousands 05:20.680 --> 05:23.963 of individuals, including journalists and academics, 05:24.050 --> 05:26.040 under an ongoing state of emergency 05:26.360 --> 05:28.313 has undermined the rule of law there. 05:29.150 --> 05:32.730 In Venezuela, the Maduro regime represses 05:32.730 --> 05:35.160 the human rights of its people and denies them 05:35.160 --> 05:37.460 the right to have a voice in their government. 05:37.670 --> 05:40.500 Thousands flee their homes daily in response 05:40.500 --> 05:42.963 to this growing humanitarian crisis. 05:43.650 --> 05:45.713 At the Summit of the Americas last week, 05:45.980 --> 05:48.330 Vice President Pence announced $16 million 05:49.080 --> 05:51.420 in humanitarian aid from the United States 05:51.710 --> 05:53.823 to help those who have fled Venezuela, 05:54.503 --> 05:57.863 and are in desperate need of food, water, and medical help. 05:58.680 --> 06:00.750 We stand by the Venezuelan people 06:00.990 --> 06:04.633 even as their leaders refuse to allow aid into the country. 06:05.470 --> 06:08.470 Finally, the Russian Government continues 06:08.470 --> 06:10.593 to quash dissent in civil society, 06:10.960 --> 06:13.760 even while it invades its neighbors and undermines 06:13.760 --> 06:15.813 the sovereignty of Western nations. 06:15.980 --> 06:19.120 We once again urge Russia to end 06:19.120 --> 06:23.103 its brutal occupation of Ukraine's Crimean Peninsula, 06:23.660 --> 06:26.180 to halt the abuses perpetrated 06:26.180 --> 06:29.763 by Russian-led forces in Ukraine's Donbas region, 06:29.960 --> 06:33.140 and to address impunity for the human rights violations 06:33.140 --> 06:35.623 and abuses in the Republic of Chechnya. 06:36.770 --> 06:39.190 That's a brief overview of the factual reports 06:39.190 --> 06:41.633 on countries of most concern. 06:42.330 --> 06:44.440 I know that Ambassador Kozak will be happy 06:44.540 --> 06:46.390 to answer any questions you may have, 06:46.550 --> 06:48.220 but before I turn the podium over to him, 06:48.220 --> 06:50.563 let me note at least a few bright spots. 06:51.990 --> 06:55.783 Uzbekistan, although there's still much progress to be made, 06:56.150 --> 06:58.730 the country has pursued a strategic reform agenda 06:58.920 --> 07:02.220 with positive effects on human rights, including the release 07:02.220 --> 07:05.023 of eight high-profile prisoners last year. 07:05.710 --> 07:09.440 In Liberia, the recent presidential election represents 07:09.440 --> 07:12.750 a milestone, marking the first peaceful transition 07:12.870 --> 07:15.260 from one democratically-elected leader 07:15.470 --> 07:17.863 to another in more than 70 years. 07:18.590 --> 07:22.110 And in Mexico, the general law on forced disappearances 07:22.370 --> 07:23.900 established criminal penalties 07:23.900 --> 07:26.830 for persons convicted of forced disappearance 07:27.010 --> 07:29.993 and a national framework to find victims. 07:30.740 --> 07:33.410 These represent a few of the more positive examples 07:33.410 --> 07:36.363 noted in the reports which are released today. 07:37.000 --> 07:39.290 We hope to see many more positive accounts 07:39.290 --> 07:43.210 of countries taking serious action to improve 07:43.210 --> 07:46.813 the human rights record in the reports next year. 07:48.660 --> 07:50.850 In conclusion, let me say America 07:50.850 --> 07:53.973 leads the way globally to promote human rights. 07:54.800 --> 07:57.550 We will also continue to impose consequences 07:57.550 --> 07:59.623 on those who abuse human rights. 07:59.930 --> 08:03.260 Over the past year, through the Russia Magnitsky 08:03.260 --> 08:06.930 and Global Magnitsky sanctions programs, we have undertaken 08:06.930 --> 08:09.163 some of our most aggressive measures yet. 08:09.920 --> 08:12.170 No human rights abuser, no matter 08:12.170 --> 08:14.683 where in the world, is out of our reach. 08:15.480 --> 08:16.810 The Human Rights Reports are 08:16.810 --> 08:19.573 a significant part of that overall effort. 08:20.130 --> 08:22.970 Creating them is an enormous undertaking 08:22.970 --> 08:24.543 and not for the fainthearted. 08:24.980 --> 08:27.440 I'm grateful to so many of my colleagues 08:27.440 --> 08:30.010 in the State Department, including those here 08:30.010 --> 08:32.490 in Washington and many others in embassies 08:32.490 --> 08:35.500 and consulates around the world, who've made 08:35.500 --> 08:38.500 these reports possible and contribute to America's 08:38.500 --> 08:41.763 longstanding leadership in promoting human rights. 08:42.390 --> 08:44.910 So with that, I'd like to turn the podium over 08:44.910 --> 08:46.860 to Acting Under Secretary Nauert 08:46.940 --> 08:50.183 and to my friend and colleague, Ambassador Mike Kozak. 08:50.260 --> 08:51.093 Thank you. 08:58.890 --> 09:00.940 - Ambassador Kozak will take some of your questions, 09:00.940 --> 09:04.713 and I'll kick off those questions, so thank you very much. 09:04.960 --> 09:06.653 One second, sir, come on up. 09:07.510 --> 09:08.343 Thank you. 09:10.880 --> 09:12.200 Let's start our first question 09:12.200 --> 09:14.303 with the Associated Press's Matt Lee. 09:14.590 --> 09:15.423 - Thank you. 09:16.730 --> 09:19.703 I realize that this report doesn't cover the United States, 09:20.800 --> 09:24.283 but in this preface and in his comments just now, 09:24.790 --> 09:26.770 Acting Secretary Sullivan talked 09:26.770 --> 09:30.920 about how the U.S. is promotes and defends rights, 09:30.920 --> 09:33.090 and that that's central to us as a country, 09:33.090 --> 09:34.950 and that the United States will lead 09:34.950 --> 09:36.920 other nations by example in promoting 09:38.440 --> 09:40.230 rule of law and respect for human rights. 09:40.230 --> 09:42.790 And I'm just wondering how effective you think 09:42.910 --> 09:45.700 that you can be in leading by example 09:46.460 --> 09:51.460 when you accuse numerous, a lot of countries 09:51.520 --> 09:54.040 of, say, assaults on press freedom, 09:54.040 --> 09:56.520 when here, in this country, we have a President 09:56.520 --> 09:59.970 who routinely excoriates the press, 09:59.970 --> 10:02.390 calling individual media outlets, 10:02.390 --> 10:05.423 and individual reporters sometimes, fake news. 10:06.830 --> 10:09.580 I'm wondering how you can criticize countries 10:09.580 --> 10:12.790 for discrimination against LGBT people 10:12.790 --> 10:17.240 when this administration's stated policy is to exclude 10:17.310 --> 10:20.293 transgender people from serving in the military. 10:20.870 --> 10:25.610 I'm wondering about criticism of other countries 10:25.610 --> 10:28.010 for discriminating against religious minorities 10:28.010 --> 10:32.360 when courts and a lot of critics see the travel ban 10:32.360 --> 10:35.123 as, in fact, a ban on one particular religion. 10:35.250 --> 10:37.180 And lastly, you criticize countries 10:37.180 --> 10:41.150 for the mistreatment and refoulement of refugees, 10:41.150 --> 10:43.620 which I suppose this administration is 10:43.620 --> 10:45.360 not in that great of a position to do 10:45.360 --> 10:48.340 because it doesn't accept hardly any refugees, 10:48.340 --> 10:50.640 or at least far fewer than it ever did before. 10:53.598 --> 10:56.820 How do you not open yourself up to charges of hypocrisy? 10:56.820 --> 10:57.653 And how effective do you think 10:57.653 --> 10:59.773 you can be at leading by example? 10:59.840 --> 11:00.673 Thank you. 11:00.850 --> 11:03.050 - Okay, let's see if I can remember each one of those. 11:03.050 --> 11:06.463 But I think as you go through the report, 11:06.470 --> 11:08.320 you'll see the countries that we criticize 11:08.320 --> 11:11.250 for limiting press freedom, it's for things 11:11.250 --> 11:13.010 like having criminal libel laws 11:13.010 --> 11:15.910 where you can be put in jail for what you say. 11:15.910 --> 11:19.360 It's for things like yanking the licenses 11:20.207 --> 11:22.230 of media outlets you don't like 11:22.230 --> 11:24.883 or, in many cases, killing the journalists. 11:25.180 --> 11:27.240 So I think we make quite a distinction 11:27.240 --> 11:31.590 between political leaders being able to speak out 11:31.590 --> 11:34.390 and say that that story was not accurate 11:34.390 --> 11:36.940 or using even stronger words sometimes, 11:36.940 --> 11:40.880 and using state power to prevent the journalists 11:40.880 --> 11:42.310 from continuing to do their work. 11:42.310 --> 11:43.910 So I think there's an example there, 11:43.910 --> 11:47.933 and we've used that with many of our colleagues. 11:48.690 --> 11:51.210 The other end of your stream was 11:51.210 --> 11:53.640 refoulement, which is a legal term. 11:53.640 --> 11:56.480 It's sending somebody back to a place 11:57.196 --> 11:58.860 where you know they're going to be persecuted 11:58.860 --> 12:00.250 or where they have a well-founded fear 12:00.250 --> 12:01.920 of persecution without going through 12:01.920 --> 12:06.400 due process to assess the risk to them. 12:06.400 --> 12:09.390 And of course, our law provides 12:09.390 --> 12:11.340 that people have rights of appeal through 12:11.340 --> 12:14.620 the immigration courts system and into the federal courts 12:14.840 --> 12:16.713 if they think they're going to be. 12:17.090 --> 12:19.050 So it doesn't go to the quantity of refugees. 12:19.050 --> 12:20.864 It goes to whether you're-- 12:20.864 --> 12:22.470 - Right, I understand, but you're not in a position 12:22.470 --> 12:25.180 if you even wanted to refoule a refugee, 12:25.180 --> 12:26.700 you don't have many to do it to. 12:26.700 --> 12:28.560 But it's also mistreatment of refugees. 12:28.560 --> 12:29.977 It's not just that, so-- 12:30.400 --> 12:32.513 - Yeah, and that usually involves, 12:32.960 --> 12:36.123 as you'll find documented in many countries in the report, 12:38.260 --> 12:41.110 physical mistreatment of refugees and that kind of thing. 12:41.260 --> 12:42.457 Your-- 12:42.952 --> 12:45.013 - LGBT. - LGBT. 12:45.190 --> 12:47.810 As we are very clear in the reports, 12:47.810 --> 12:51.603 and this has been U.S. policy for some time, 12:52.030 --> 12:54.570 the things we're focused on are 12:56.870 --> 12:59.490 has the government in question criminalized 12:59.490 --> 13:02.940 same-sex sexual activity, and that's highlighted 13:02.940 --> 13:04.793 now right up front in the reports, 13:06.148 --> 13:09.710 have they failed to prevent violence against people 13:09.710 --> 13:14.150 because of their LGBT status, or the same applies 13:14.150 --> 13:16.793 to ethnic groups and religious and so on, 13:17.130 --> 13:20.030 and then, third, discrimination in housing, 13:20.030 --> 13:21.883 employment, and government services. 13:22.400 --> 13:25.410 Usually, military and police are 13:26.230 --> 13:28.813 a slightly different form of government employment, 13:29.210 --> 13:31.210 so you can have a debate about that one, 13:31.350 --> 13:33.310 but most of the other countries 13:33.680 --> 13:37.420 where we're criticizing them, I think we would be very happy 13:37.420 --> 13:40.963 if they were following procedures we are. 13:41.110 --> 13:42.890 There are a lot of policy decisions 13:42.890 --> 13:44.610 in these areas that governments make 13:44.610 --> 13:46.870 that aren't internationally recognized human rights, 13:46.870 --> 13:48.360 so that's where we try to distinguish, 13:48.360 --> 13:49.710 and that's nothing new. 13:49.710 --> 13:51.200 That's been the case in the last couple 13:51.200 --> 13:53.253 of administrations as well. 13:53.480 --> 13:54.430 - [Matt] Thank you. 13:54.809 --> 13:56.040 - [Heather] Michelle from CNN. 13:56.040 --> 13:56.873 - Yeah. 13:56.873 --> 13:58.620 - I'd like to know if you think that such statements 13:58.620 --> 14:00.560 in the United States weaken the impact of this report 14:00.560 --> 14:03.330 because the American President has called 14:03.330 --> 14:05.790 the press an enemy of the people. 14:05.790 --> 14:09.260 And I think at one point he called for a closer look 14:09.260 --> 14:10.870 at libel laws or something like that. 14:10.870 --> 14:13.260 Do you think in the eyes of people 14:13.260 --> 14:15.003 that are looking at this report, 14:15.070 --> 14:17.713 as an example and as a resource, 14:18.220 --> 14:21.157 do statements like that currently weaken its impact? 14:21.830 --> 14:23.660 - Well, I think the report is very clear 14:23.660 --> 14:26.800 about the kinds of things that we consider to be 14:27.310 --> 14:31.143 inappropriate restrictions on freedom of the media, 14:31.260 --> 14:34.430 as I mentioned, using the legal system 14:34.430 --> 14:36.113 to go after members of the press, 14:36.450 --> 14:38.853 using physical force and so on. 14:38.970 --> 14:42.720 It doesn't go to the nature of discourse in a country. 14:42.720 --> 14:44.670 And you can have your own judgments 14:44.670 --> 14:48.440 as to how strong a statement might or might not be, 14:48.440 --> 14:50.600 but I don't think we have a hard time 14:50.600 --> 14:52.520 explaining that in a lot of places. 14:52.520 --> 14:56.210 When you talk to some of my friends in Cuba, for example, 14:56.210 --> 14:58.360 who try to be independent journalists there 14:58.610 --> 15:00.783 and are routinely slapped around, 15:01.490 --> 15:03.490 they also get called names, but I think 15:03.490 --> 15:06.160 if it were limited to that, they'd be pretty happy 15:06.683 --> 15:09.000 (chuckles) as compared to the situation they're in now. 15:09.000 --> 15:11.420 - And when the State Department is talking about 15:12.530 --> 15:14.963 this represents our values as Americans, 15:15.060 --> 15:18.460 the removal of sections on women's reproductive rights, 15:18.460 --> 15:22.983 why is that not included in values as Americans? 15:23.984 --> 15:27.410 - There's still a long section on women. 15:27.410 --> 15:30.930 And by the way, if you look elsewhere in the report, I mean, 15:30.930 --> 15:34.847 women are also activists, are also journalists, they're-- 15:34.847 --> 15:37.720 - Understood, but it's so conspicuous that it's removed. 15:37.720 --> 15:41.480 - Now, I'm gonna explain why it was removed. 15:41.480 --> 15:46.180 It was introduced six years ago into the report. 15:46.180 --> 15:47.763 It hadn't been there before. 15:51.690 --> 15:54.360 It's one of the few terms that are used in the report 15:54.360 --> 15:57.060 that isn't derived from an international treaty 15:57.060 --> 15:59.610 that has a definition or derived from U.S. law, 15:59.610 --> 16:02.423 where there's a clear definition to the term. 16:03.470 --> 16:07.920 And in this case, the previous administration intended it 16:07.920 --> 16:12.920 to mean look at the availability of contraception, 16:14.724 --> 16:18.513 whether the government tried to impose or coerce people 16:19.150 --> 16:22.483 in making decisions about reproduction. 16:23.210 --> 16:25.440 In the statements that were made, this was derived 16:25.440 --> 16:29.553 from the Beijing Declaration that was done in the '90s, 16:30.600 --> 16:32.047 at that time, it was very clear 16:32.047 --> 16:34.260 and our delegation made a very clear statement 16:34.260 --> 16:35.900 that this has nothing to do with abortion, 16:35.900 --> 16:38.400 it doesn't mean abortion, it doesn't mean abortion. 16:38.400 --> 16:40.913 Unfortunately, over the last few years, 16:41.230 --> 16:43.450 groups on both sides of that issue domestically 16:43.450 --> 16:46.980 have started to use the term, and both seem to think 16:46.980 --> 16:49.763 it does include abortion and then argue about it. 16:49.940 --> 16:53.080 So our thought was let's just not use a term 16:53.080 --> 16:55.510 that has the opposite meaning from the one we intend. 16:55.510 --> 16:57.980 We went back to the term that's used 16:57.980 --> 17:00.640 in the U.S. statute that requires the Human Rights Report, 17:00.640 --> 17:03.743 which is coerced family planning, 17:03.920 --> 17:08.693 namely coerced abortion or involuntary sterilization. 17:08.880 --> 17:10.950 I might mention, too, 'cause I went back and looked 17:10.950 --> 17:14.063 at last year's report, the question being asked was, 17:14.367 --> 17:17.160 "Were there obstacles opposed to getting 17:17.677 --> 17:21.927 "contraception information and means?" 17:22.470 --> 17:25.440 The answer in virtually every country was, no, 17:25.440 --> 17:27.390 there were no obstacles other than, 17:27.390 --> 17:29.650 in almost every country, including our own, 17:29.650 --> 17:31.970 the availability in rural areas is 17:31.970 --> 17:33.653 less than it is in urban areas, 17:33.730 --> 17:36.010 but we were taking a lot of space to explain that. 17:36.010 --> 17:39.240 So what we've done, we've kept that information in there. 17:39.240 --> 17:40.700 We've done it now by a hyperlink. 17:40.700 --> 17:42.250 We used to take that information 17:42.250 --> 17:44.623 from the WHO report and put it in. 17:44.800 --> 17:47.040 We said let's just use a hyperlink, and then there's 17:47.040 --> 17:49.373 actually more information available that way, 17:49.490 --> 17:51.680 so that's the rationale behind that. 17:51.680 --> 17:53.770 It's not a diminishment of women's rights 17:53.770 --> 17:55.650 or a desire to get away from it. 17:55.650 --> 17:58.070 It was to stop using a term 17:58.070 --> 18:00.370 that has several different meanings 18:00.450 --> 18:02.527 that are not all the ones we intend. 18:02.671 --> 18:04.462 - [Heather] Okay, Dave Clark from AFP. 18:04.462 --> 18:05.762 - Hi, thank you very much. 18:06.670 --> 18:09.070 When countries around the world are looking at the U.S. 18:09.070 --> 18:11.900 for leadership on human rights, 18:11.900 --> 18:13.170 should they be looking at this report, 18:13.170 --> 18:15.570 or should they be looking at President Trump's embrace 18:15.570 --> 18:18.960 of Rodrigo Duterte, of meeting with Sisi, 18:18.960 --> 18:22.583 and with the very warm relations with Mohammed bin Salman, 18:22.720 --> 18:25.553 who runs a country where women have no rights at all? 18:27.240 --> 18:28.560 What sends the stronger signal, 18:28.560 --> 18:31.110 the President's close personal friendship with Xi Jinping 18:31.110 --> 18:33.250 and his golf tours at Mar-a-Lago 18:33.410 --> 18:36.963 or you at that podium decrying human rights abuses? 18:37.664 --> 18:39.990 - Well, this is a official report, 18:39.990 --> 18:41.180 and by the way, I think it's one 18:41.180 --> 18:43.720 of the most widely-read U.S. Government documents 18:43.720 --> 18:47.573 in the world when we do the hit counts on the internet. 18:48.700 --> 18:51.720 It's put out in the name of the Secretary of State, 18:51.720 --> 18:53.100 who was just here to deliver it, 18:53.100 --> 18:56.253 and he certainly is reflecting the President in this. 18:56.490 --> 19:01.090 I think this is showing what we assess to be 19:01.090 --> 19:03.410 the human rights situation in all of the countries 19:03.410 --> 19:06.120 you've just mentioned, including, now even more so, 19:06.120 --> 19:07.810 the responsibility of the government 19:07.810 --> 19:09.973 for the abuses that are occurring there. 19:11.220 --> 19:12.430 We're not just saying there are 19:12.430 --> 19:14.463 these societal problems in the country. 19:14.550 --> 19:16.220 We're saying the government either 19:16.220 --> 19:20.023 has done these bad deeds or not. 19:20.400 --> 19:22.173 And I'll give you some examples. 19:23.040 --> 19:25.453 In Russia, we highlighted the fact, 19:25.530 --> 19:29.690 their response to an increase in domestic violence there, 19:29.690 --> 19:31.060 and they have a terrible problem, 19:31.060 --> 19:34.110 I mean tens of thousands of deaths of women 19:34.110 --> 19:36.853 being killed in domestic disputes every year. 19:37.350 --> 19:40.350 But since it went up, the government spokesman 19:40.350 --> 19:42.757 who went into the State Duma said, 19:42.757 --> 19:44.657 "Well, we have to decriminalize this 19:44.657 --> 19:46.917 "because it's better that our women be beaten 19:46.917 --> 19:49.647 "than that our men be humiliated by their behavior." 19:50.180 --> 19:55.110 And this was Putin's party, they decriminalized 19:55.510 --> 19:58.363 spousal beating, so not a very good thing. 19:58.370 --> 19:59.880 Now, does that mean that the President 19:59.880 --> 20:02.023 should never speak to these people? 20:02.870 --> 20:05.830 We're trying to keep the report as the factual baseline 20:05.830 --> 20:08.350 for what we're going to do in policy terms 20:08.350 --> 20:11.223 or sanctions, as the Secretary was mentioning. 20:12.360 --> 20:13.940 So we can learn a lot from this, 20:13.940 --> 20:15.820 and we can use it to formulate a policy. 20:15.820 --> 20:20.350 But usually part of your policy is engaging with the people 20:20.350 --> 20:23.003 whose behavior you're trying to change at some level. 20:23.290 --> 20:27.373 And I don't think those two things are in distinction. 20:27.540 --> 20:30.220 The fact is, these other governments and their populations 20:30.220 --> 20:34.660 do read the report, and I don't think they discount it 20:34.660 --> 20:38.480 because the President speaks with their leader or otherwise. 20:38.480 --> 20:41.210 And when the President speaks with their leader, often he's 20:41.210 --> 20:44.773 talking about these issues, so it's complementary. 20:45.393 --> 20:49.257 It's not two things that are in conflict 20:49.257 --> 20:50.103 - Since we're citing examples, 20:50.103 --> 20:52.493 what does Saudi law say about spousal abuse? 20:52.880 --> 20:56.940 - Saudi law is very, very restrictive on women. 20:56.940 --> 20:58.980 We've tried to encourage changes in that. 20:58.980 --> 21:01.610 We've seen the minor changes that are reflected 21:01.610 --> 21:05.510 in the report, that they've started to say 21:05.510 --> 21:07.850 they're going to allow women to drive cars and so on. 21:07.850 --> 21:10.880 That isn't very much, but it is a baby step 21:10.880 --> 21:13.020 in the right direction, and we're trying 21:13.020 --> 21:15.700 to encourage more of that kind of reform 21:15.700 --> 21:19.350 at the same time that we're calling out the areas 21:19.350 --> 21:21.500 in which they're deficient, which are many. 21:22.105 --> 21:23.660 - [Heather] All right, Rich Hudson from Fox News. 21:23.660 --> 21:24.570 - Thanks, Heather. 21:24.570 --> 21:25.830 Ambassador, I want to follow up a little bit 21:25.830 --> 21:27.370 on Saudi Arabia, the conversation 21:27.370 --> 21:28.920 you were just having with Dave. 21:29.190 --> 21:30.600 You note in the report, and a lot has happened 21:30.600 --> 21:32.415 on the government level in Saudi Arabia 21:32.415 --> 21:34.080 in just the past year, and you note in the report 21:34.080 --> 21:38.184 the jailing or hoteling of 200 officials there. 21:38.184 --> 21:42.390 - Hoteling, that's a good (laughs). 21:42.390 --> 21:45.720 - Overall in Saudi Arabia, are you encouraged 21:45.720 --> 21:47.773 by some of the things that are happening? 21:48.360 --> 21:50.470 Are you discouraged by what's happened over the past year? 21:50.470 --> 21:52.973 Where do you see the trend going in Saudi Arabia? 21:54.010 --> 21:56.020 - Well, of course it's always hard to predict trends, 21:56.020 --> 21:59.450 but I think I'm always encouraged when you start to see 21:59.450 --> 22:03.923 things break out of a static holding pattern. 22:03.940 --> 22:06.310 When you see a little bit of change 22:06.310 --> 22:08.083 as we're seeing in Saudi Arabia, 22:08.200 --> 22:12.433 and the hoteling was connected to, ostensibly anyway, 22:12.830 --> 22:14.830 to more of concern about corruption, 22:14.830 --> 22:18.910 which is another one of our issues, insofar as corruption 22:18.910 --> 22:22.523 and human rights abuse tend to go together. 22:22.770 --> 22:25.060 So we're trying to encourage that kind 22:25.060 --> 22:28.600 of movement on the part of the Saudis. 22:28.600 --> 22:30.987 At the same time, you can look at that and say, 22:30.987 --> 22:33.810 "Well, you didn't do this with sufficient due process," 22:33.810 --> 22:36.302 and I think that's also well spelled-out here. 22:36.302 --> 22:39.353 So it's trying to get that right balance of, 22:39.800 --> 22:41.880 hey, here's where we think you're deficient, 22:41.880 --> 22:44.960 but we're seeing some movement and we're trying to encourage 22:44.960 --> 22:47.160 the movement in the positive direction and see more. 22:47.160 --> 22:48.900 But I'm usually more encouraged 22:48.900 --> 22:52.100 when I see some movement going on than when things are 22:52.100 --> 22:56.250 just stuck in the same rut for years and years and years. 22:56.250 --> 23:00.823 So, in that sense, at least there's an opportunity there. 23:01.000 --> 23:03.053 We'll see if it comes to anything. 23:03.410 --> 23:06.216 - [Matt] So is hoteling now going to be standard language-- 23:06.216 --> 23:08.740 - (laughs) I think your colleague 23:08.740 --> 23:10.617 just came up with a new term with-- 23:10.700 --> 23:12.029 - [Heather] Cindy with Voice of America. 23:12.029 --> 23:13.062 We have a few minutes left. 23:13.062 --> 23:13.895 - [Cindy] Yes, thank you. 23:13.895 --> 23:16.430 We were talking about press freedoms, and you're probably 23:16.430 --> 23:19.370 aware that in Nicaragua, the Ortega Government ordered 23:19.370 --> 23:21.770 at least five television stations off the air 23:21.950 --> 23:24.003 for their coverage of massive protests. 23:24.370 --> 23:26.070 What is the U.S. Government prepared to do 23:26.070 --> 23:27.993 to stem this new wave of repression? 23:29.770 --> 23:32.220 - Well, Nicaragua is, and I think if you looked 23:32.220 --> 23:34.440 at the report, is going the wrong direction 23:34.440 --> 23:36.990 on many fronts and that is one of them, 23:36.990 --> 23:41.300 of media freedom, but also on all the basics. 23:41.300 --> 23:43.600 I mean, it's a long litany of torture, 23:43.600 --> 23:47.413 extrajudicial killing, the elections were a sham. 23:48.370 --> 23:52.430 And so we've put more and more pressure on, 23:52.430 --> 23:56.383 I think you'll see some of the sanctions programs 23:58.490 --> 24:01.583 will start to affect some people in that country. 24:01.900 --> 24:02.950 But it's a tough one. 24:03.150 --> 24:06.990 The Ortega Government has basically 24:06.990 --> 24:09.270 shut down a lot of the opposition, 24:09.270 --> 24:13.430 a lot of the independent civil society organizations 24:13.430 --> 24:16.750 as well as the free media, so I mean, 24:16.750 --> 24:19.930 in our policy everywhere, and certainly in Nicaragua, 24:19.930 --> 24:23.170 is to try to provide both moral 24:23.170 --> 24:26.860 and to the extent we can support NGOs 24:26.860 --> 24:30.370 and so on that are working to help them keep working, 24:30.370 --> 24:33.330 help free media keep working, and bring 24:33.330 --> 24:35.933 about a change in that dimension. 24:36.710 --> 24:38.980 It's tough, but we can't do it ourselves. 24:38.980 --> 24:41.400 We have to be in a position of supporting the people 24:41.400 --> 24:43.810 in those countries that are trying to bring about change, 24:43.810 --> 24:46.373 and we try to do that through a variety of means. 24:46.620 --> 24:50.610 The Secretary, I'm not sure he met with any Nicaraguans, 24:50.610 --> 24:53.240 but at the Summit of the Americas had meetings 24:53.240 --> 24:56.780 with civil society activists from Cuba, Venezuela, 24:56.780 --> 25:00.661 same camp as Nicaragua, and it was in part 25:00.661 --> 25:04.420 just to show that we stand with them 25:04.420 --> 25:06.240 and that we're trying to be supportive 25:06.240 --> 25:07.360 of what they're trying to do to bring 25:07.360 --> 25:09.060 about change in their own country. 25:09.735 --> 25:12.100 - [Heather] Janne, Janne, excuse me. 25:12.100 --> 25:12.942 Janne, go right ahead. 25:12.942 --> 25:15.787 - On North Korean human rights issues, 25:15.787 --> 25:19.890 as the North Korean nuclear issue is an important issue 25:20.220 --> 25:24.983 and the North Korean human rights is also serious issues, 25:25.370 --> 25:29.213 unless the regime of the North Korean Kim Jong-un changes, 25:29.790 --> 25:32.840 the North Korean human rights abuse 25:32.840 --> 25:36.363 against the North Korean people will continue. 25:36.870 --> 25:40.873 What is the U.S. solutions on this? 25:41.760 --> 25:44.980 - Okay, I mean, we are concerned 25:46.031 --> 25:48.363 about the nuclear issue in North Korea, 25:48.560 --> 25:50.920 but we're equally concerned about the human rights issue, 25:50.920 --> 25:53.613 and they both derive from the same problem. 25:54.680 --> 25:56.770 And I think you see in the report 25:56.770 --> 26:01.330 we've laid out pretty starkly the kinds of abuses, 26:01.330 --> 26:04.600 and over the last year or two, we've supported 26:04.760 --> 26:07.050 a commission of inquiry on North Korea. 26:07.050 --> 26:10.580 We support NGOs that are working on North Korea 26:10.580 --> 26:13.070 and exposing the human rights abuses 26:13.070 --> 26:15.653 that occur in the camps there and so on. 26:15.880 --> 26:18.950 But some of the stories that are contained 26:18.950 --> 26:21.100 in the report are just overwhelming. 26:21.100 --> 26:25.050 There's one about 11 people who were arrested 26:25.050 --> 26:27.680 for supposedly making a pornographic film 26:28.110 --> 26:31.900 and they were executed by shooting 26:32.110 --> 26:34.113 anti-artillery weapons at them, 26:34.250 --> 26:37.050 and then they brought out tanks and ran over the bodies, 26:37.340 --> 26:40.530 and this is supposed to be a civilized country. 26:40.530 --> 26:45.370 So I don't think you will see a diminishment in our concern 26:45.370 --> 26:48.337 about that issue even as we try to work the nuclear issue. 26:48.337 --> 26:50.283 It's not a trade-off. 26:51.260 --> 26:52.480 I think the President's laid out 26:52.480 --> 26:54.710 a vision there that North Korea can 26:54.710 --> 26:58.340 get on a much better path, but it needs to make progress 26:58.340 --> 27:00.823 across the board, not just on one issue. 27:01.397 --> 27:02.653 - [Heather] Michel. 27:03.259 --> 27:04.959 - Yeah, thank you. 27:04.959 --> 27:08.800 Sir, the report considers China, Russia, Iran, 27:08.800 --> 27:11.383 and North Korea forces of instability. 27:12.060 --> 27:13.180 What do you mean by that? 27:13.180 --> 27:15.483 And will there be any consequences? 27:17.980 --> 27:19.350 - Well, I don't know that we've called them 27:19.350 --> 27:22.560 as forces of instability in the report, perhaps-- 27:22.560 --> 27:24.057 - [Michel] Yeah, in the-- 27:24.057 --> 27:25.793 - In the preface, okay. 27:26.160 --> 27:27.660 Well, I think that has to do 27:27.660 --> 27:30.480 with their international behavior 27:30.480 --> 27:33.293 as well as their internal behavior. 27:33.490 --> 27:36.100 I mean, sometimes, internal behavior, 27:36.100 --> 27:37.500 you can't really separate them 27:37.500 --> 27:40.133 because when you start oppressing your own people, 27:40.410 --> 27:45.410 you generate refugee flows, you generate humanitarian crises 27:45.680 --> 27:48.943 like you're seeing in Venezuela, for example. 27:52.330 --> 27:54.470 Saying something is a force of instability 27:54.470 --> 27:58.190 is saying or characterizing a set of facts. 27:58.190 --> 28:02.063 It doesn't necessarily have a prescribed policy flow. 28:02.080 --> 28:03.630 None of this does. 28:03.630 --> 28:07.120 This report doesn't say countries that reach a certain level 28:07.120 --> 28:09.420 we're gonna cut off aid or something like that. 28:09.420 --> 28:12.100 It's the factual predicate for making those decisions, 28:12.100 --> 28:13.990 but those are policy decisions 28:13.990 --> 28:16.640 where the President and his advisors 28:16.640 --> 28:19.073 will have to weigh a whole number of factors. 28:19.770 --> 28:22.820 - [Heather] And our final question, Kylie from CBS News. 28:24.572 --> 28:26.700 - Can I just go back to the reproductive rights 28:26.700 --> 28:27.533 for a second? 28:27.533 --> 28:30.740 So you said there are no obstacles for women 28:30.740 --> 28:32.570 to get contraception in any country 28:33.320 --> 28:36.023 except for if there's a remote issue, right? 28:36.950 --> 28:40.710 - I said with some exceptions, and the exceptions were 28:40.710 --> 28:43.580 and still are, and we've really gotten at it 28:43.580 --> 28:47.793 by flipping it back to the original U.S. statutory language. 28:48.030 --> 28:51.340 It's in places like China, where in order 28:51.340 --> 28:55.863 to enforce their now two-child policy, 28:56.530 --> 28:59.360 that there are reports of coerced abortion 28:59.360 --> 29:01.533 and involuntary sterilization. 29:01.740 --> 29:06.310 In North Korea, where the government also coerces 29:07.340 --> 29:09.420 or forces abortion, although sometimes that's 29:09.420 --> 29:12.073 for political punishment rather than family planning. 29:12.210 --> 29:15.870 And we uncovered it, so as we were digging through trying 29:15.870 --> 29:19.943 to reduce the bulk of some of this report, 29:20.250 --> 29:23.363 I found in the old country I served in, in Belarus, 29:23.630 --> 29:26.820 that it turns out that the doctors in the state hospitals, 29:26.820 --> 29:28.670 and particularly in the institutions there, 29:28.670 --> 29:31.980 if they have a woman who is pregnant 29:31.980 --> 29:34.693 and who is a woman with disabilities, 29:34.900 --> 29:37.133 the doctors insist on an abortion. 29:37.300 --> 29:41.450 Or if they believe the fetus has a disability, 29:41.450 --> 29:43.130 they'll insist on an abortion, 29:43.130 --> 29:44.630 so we've called that out, too. 29:46.010 --> 29:49.630 Those were the cases, though, under the previous formula 29:49.630 --> 29:51.680 where you would say there was a restriction 29:51.680 --> 29:56.680 on family planning, freedom of family planning. 29:56.680 --> 29:59.810 For most countries, it said there isn't 29:59.810 --> 30:02.910 any restriction except for the ones imposed 30:02.910 --> 30:06.930 by economics and rural-urban type thing. 30:06.930 --> 30:09.130 - [Kylie] So just to be clear just on that, 30:09.130 --> 30:13.070 so taking out the language about those cases 30:13.600 --> 30:16.470 therefore means that the U.S. doesn't believe 30:16.470 --> 30:19.580 that the inability for women to get an abortion physically 30:19.580 --> 30:22.713 or by law is an abuse of human rights? 30:23.160 --> 30:25.690 - That's correct under the previous administration 30:25.690 --> 30:27.650 and this one and the one before that. 30:27.650 --> 30:31.310 We have never taken the position that abortion was 30:32.539 --> 30:34.753 a human right under international law. 30:34.753 --> 30:36.890 This is supposed to be internationally-recognized 30:36.890 --> 30:40.820 human rights, and it's an issue on which 30:41.610 --> 30:44.070 some countries prohibit abortion, some countries, 30:44.070 --> 30:47.863 like our own, have pretty much no restriction on it, 30:48.240 --> 30:49.670 and we don't say one of those is 30:49.670 --> 30:50.840 right and one of those is wrong. 30:50.840 --> 30:54.270 We don't report on it because it's not a human right. 30:54.270 --> 30:56.890 It's an issue of great policy debate, 30:56.890 --> 30:58.830 you can have a good discussion, 30:58.830 --> 31:01.560 but there's no internationally-recognized standard 31:01.560 --> 31:03.963 as to what's the right treatment. 31:04.220 --> 31:09.170 But the other, yes, it is internationally recognized 31:09.170 --> 31:11.340 that somebody shouldn't coerce you to have an abortion 31:11.340 --> 31:13.680 or force you to be sterilized, so that's-- 31:13.848 --> 31:14.993 - Thank you, sir. 31:15.565 --> 31:17.210 The ambassador has to go. 31:17.210 --> 31:18.043 Thank you so much. 31:18.043 --> 31:19.563 We have to go. 31:19.880 --> 31:20.713 Sir, thank you. 31:20.713 --> 31:21.546 Thank you. 31:21.546 --> 31:22.773 We'll get you another time. 31:23.030 --> 31:23.863 Sir, thank you. 31:24.320 --> 31:25.987 Go ahead, it's okay. 31:26.055 --> 31:26.888 Thank you. 31:33.117 --> 31:35.050 And we'll have some readouts as we go along. 31:35.050 --> 31:36.400 We'll look forward to seeing you then. 31:36.400 --> 31:37.233 Thanks.